Entdecke FRITZ! - Informiere dich über die vielseitigen und benutzerfreundlichen Lösungen für deinen Internetanschluss und deine Heimvernetzung.
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Sounds good on paper, until you look a bit deeper and find they are actually a horrible company. GPL violations and active opposition to right-to-repair, as well as the notion that you own the hardware you bought from them.
wasn’t it also sold to a chinese company? at least avm was sold
Do you know of any European alternative that would be better?
Turris
Mikrotik?
Seems to be made in Asia from what I read
Fritz got European chips? Didn’t know anyone in Europe made competitive ASICs
You’re right.
Actually I just reread the thread where I saw Fritz mentioned, seem like both indeed use Asian chips: https://old.reddit.com/r/BuyFromEU/comments/1tgehr7/tough_one_any_network_electronics_made_in_eu_like/
Unofrunately that’s kinda hard. The have essentially a monopoly in Germany, or close to it, so I don’t even regularly see alternatives.
Depending on what application you need it for, and what your own skill level is, there is Mikrotik (Latvia). They make all kinds of network gear, including routers (with and without wifi). But if you need the Cable or DSL modem part, I don’t think they have that. In general, they are more aimed at a professional than a home level equipment. They are vastly more powerful in terms of capability/configuration, but also require a deeper knowledge and are just by default more complex.
So there might just not be “good” alternatives, and at least AVM (the company that makes the Fritz-products) is in fact European/German, which is better than nothing…
which is better than nothing…
Yeah, that’s probably it. Unfortunately, as you said, options are limited.
What problems with owning the hardware did you face?
I have one and have changed various configurations - it’s now mostly just a DSL passthrough device at the moment, but I haven’t noticed any restrictions…
Around a decade ago, I used a Firtz!box for my internet, like most people. I needed more functionality that it couldn’t provide, but I knew the hardware was capable, and since it’s just a Linux underneath I thought it should be possible. Soon enough I found the “Freetz-ng” project and got my solution, patched my kernel and all was fine. I don’t remember what the exact breaking point was, I might have had to move to a “bigger” (read: newer) Fritz!box to support a faster DSL version. Around that time AVM stopped releasing the kernel sources they used (obviously a GPL violation), so I could no longer patch my kernel and get the functionality I wanted. All mechanisms for me to do this were still there, they just actively refused. I even wrote them mails asking for the sources, and at first I just got a bit of a runaround, and eventually they just ghosted me I think. I certainly never got the sources I needed though.
I don’t know if this GPL situation was ever fixed, or if they got sued, or if they just locked down the devices even harder to prohibit any system level access in the first palce (arguably just as bad, but they’d probably say it’s for “security”, aka the grownup version of “think of the children”). I haven’t looked back and would not consider using any of their devices ever again.
Just if you want “official” confirmation of their illegal (monopolistic) business practices, there’s a fine handed out by the german antitrust authority (Kartellamt) for 16 million € in 2024 for artificial price inflation or price fixing, not sure what the proper english term is (source in german).
They were recently sold to private equity https://winfuture.de/news,1438441.html which could change nothing, but time will tell.
European private equity though I think?
Yeah think so
Seems that company is not exactly nice enough. But as an owner of a device myself, I cannot recommend it more.
I got 6490 used because one that comes with ISP is crap, new is 170eur, and I cannot connect anything else but DOCSIS cable to get internet. It is truly a great device. Tons of settings, very versatile, doesn’t need to be restarted (previously owned D-Link and TP-Link had bugs that require me to restart them from time to time).
If I ever get a new network device, it will be FritzBox. Hope they wont entshittify by that time.
AVM products are good. A router is a critical part of the internet infrastructure regarding security. And they are predominantly made in Germany. I wound rather have a router made in Germany than in China.
I have the 7530 AX currently as a router. Worked great for 3 years straight, no issues, easy-to-navigate UI. I can recommend for the average user.
My only niggle is lack of some advanced features like VLAN, which is why I’m dropping it during the next move.
I got a 7690 SK Modem/Router because my ISP recommended it and they offered to rent it out or sell it to me, which I really appreciate! Especially after being stuck with a shitty rushed ISP branded garbage router that’s supposed to do 1GB per second but then chokes on its own dust after 2 minutes of real usage, after which it would continue to perform terrible until you reset it.
They include inbound wireguard as standard. Got one free from my ISP and it’s been awesome.
I find their routers quite expensive. Here in Greece lots of people buy them.
I found out about it when I moved to Luxembourg. Great equipment! At home I use mikrotik but compared to fritz it is a lot more complicated to navigate the UI.
