Is anyone going to comment on the AI slop image used by the guardian?
My beard always gets me funny looks when I use the ladies’ room.
There’s a simple solution to this that I’ve seen some bars in my city do. Make all the cubicles and urinals gender-neutral and mark them as such.
This seems like the obvious solution. An area for stand-up wees. An area for sit-down wees and poos. Everyone can wash their hands together in an open area.
No need to bring gender into expelling waste. Wouldn’t be surprised to find modern toilets were invented by the Victorians so men wouldn’t have to find out that women also shit.
women also shit.
THEY WHAT?
Never thought I’d ask this but… how do I determine the gender of my toilet? And how do I confirm it’s cis-gendered?
You ask it nicely
Bzzt, wrong! You gotta barge into the stall and demand to see its equipment, outing yourself as a creep.
It’s like you didn’t even study for the fascist test, honestly.
Didn’t even know I was taking the fascist test. In that case I’d say barge in and pull the toilet’s pants down to check.
They want trans genocide, they aren’t even trying to hide it anymore
How is this trans genocide? I’m genuinely wondering how wanting to keep toilets separated by biological sex is genocidal.
Trans genocide is when I can’t go to exclusive female place.
Why are you trying to get into female-exclusive places?
Cause I indentify as a female
Why do gendered toilets exist anymore? It’s the 21st century and we don’t need them.
Because peeing and defecating are kinda private activities. One involves the anus, the other involves genitalia. I mean I’m sure a woman wouldn’t want to go into a restroom and see guys with their dicks out peeing in urinals?
Guys don’t want to see that either. That’s why urinal etiquette exists.
Did we ever need them?
It’s because of this people think girls don’t poop lol
No, we never needed gendered restrooms. IIRC it was established out of an abundance of caution when women started entering the general workforce in WWI. Men were concerned that women may need a place to rest away from men at work. It turns out women are fine and just need a stall to shit equal to everyone else.
In ww1 the men’s toilets consisted of a long urinal and a stall at the end to shit in. Society at the time thought it wasn’t appropriate for women to walk past a load of men with their dicks out to get to the one facility they could use.
Times are different now, though.
Do you want people to pee on the bathroom doors? Because that’s how you get people to pee on bathroom doors.
I thought that toilets were a primarily a public health concern. If they are not provided then unfortunate things start happening in secluded corners.
Isn’t that the goal here? Exclude people from toilets. They have to pee elsewhere. Arrest them for public urination or “indecent exposure”. Maybe put them on some kind of sex offender list like the Americans are doing for people caught urinating in public. Spread fear about “trans sex offenders”.
I’m sure you are right. There is a lot of weirdness around this. No one argues that gay people can’t use toilets (at least not yet). Picking on trans people is really pretty much that, misplaced prejudice.
I’m having an argument with idiots here in Australia trying to “protect women”. No joke, most of them are toxic blokes who are trying to be masculine. I even got told by one I’m not a man, because I should be protecting women.
In another thread, there was a guy who was posting back and forth telling me I was a guy dictating things… whilst, I didn’t even comment what should be done. I just commented that climbing gyms are running womxn nights for years without issue and it’s a non issue is causing some of them to go nuts
In fact, they solved the dilemma entirely by just going unisex (and, the toilet cubicles are full length and mostly soundproof it feels like, so they’re actually awesome
As far as I can tell the UK is the only country in the whole of Europe following America down this specific insane moral and political rabbit-hole.
It’s like they tried to get into the XXI century, failed and decided to go back to their time of greatness, the Victorian Era.
Following? Make no mistake, TERF island has been pioneering this. The American Right has been funding TERF groups there as a test bed. It’s spilling over into the former territories like NZ too - a few days ago the coalition government there voted through a first reading of a „definition of man and woman“ bill (bills go through three readings before becoming law)
They do have a prominent billionaire who is bribing anyone to take up her anti-trans positions.
You’re a TERF, Harry
ah yes the rest of Europe is super tolerant against trans people. LOL. Russia has a laws that forbids gender reassignment surgery. And they have a law that bans LGBTQ “propaganda” basically write or film something positive or even neutral information about the LGBTQ will get you in jail. Hungary and Poland haven’t been very friendly against queers in the last decade. Almost every right wing party in Europe that has “family values” on their agenda wants to see trans people gone.
Hungary and Poland both just emerged from their very own far-right populist period.
Meanwhile Britain supposedly did too and then elected a supposedly “center” - “left” government and instead of it getting better this shit just got worse. Oh, and the Brexiter Tories were apparently not Right-wing enough for a large fraction of the population so Reform UK rose.
Even the “left” in Britain are nutters compared to all of Western, Northern and Southern Europe.
I’ll give you Russia, thought - it is indeed comparable to Britain in terms of having 19th century morals.
Its interesting change. Considering companies has always been pro whatever is profitable. The question why this shift happened without any push back from companies and wealthy people. In fact most of these decisions seems to cost people more money.
This is going to make it so difficult to plan out businesses and buildings that everyone will end up with gender neutral bathrooms and spaces. It’s my dream that all those lobby groups who think they’re protecting women will have to shit next to every man, woman, femboy, adult baby, theydy, them, zem, furry and otherkin in the UK.
No, there’s already rules in place from the previous government which says that all new builds and buildings euch are changing their use must have separate, sex-segregated toilets, unless the building is physically too small for anything other than a single room with a single toilet and sink. You can have gender-neutral toilets as well but not instead
From the article:
“The law here is a mess, and clearly many businesses will just go gender neutral to avoid the headache,
Extant businesses may. Your post mentioned planning out businesses and buildings. If there’s space for single-sex toilets then under current legislation it would be illegal not to have them. You can thank the Tories for that. Badenoch even explicitly said that it was done to target trans people, although obviously not in quite those words
I don’t know what you’re arguing with. Planning doesn’t create new space and resources from thin air.
guardian says these rules allow only providing universal toilets “where there is insufficient space” for separate facilities
Yes, exactly
All of this is solved with just using more single occupancy bathrooms. Just an open hallway with rooms and toilets and changing stations. Sinks in the hallway.
Not allowed. I’ll copy from another post:
No, there’s already rules in place from the previous government which says that all new builds and buildings euch are changing their use must have separate, sex-segregated toilets, unless the building is physically too small for anything other than a single room with a single toilet and sink. You can have gender-neutral toilets as well but not instead
All single toilets are sex-segregated if you enter alone and close the door.
Your sex is on one side of the door, all other sexes are on the other.
The issue only happens when you attempt to write a sign that predicts the sex, or if more people has to take a shit together in the same room.
As the law stands at the moment, if you’re building a new non-domestic building or changing the function of an existing building and you have three toilets, each of which is a single room containing one individual toilet and a sink and which can be locked from the inside, then cannot all be accessible to everybody. One must be exclusively for women and one for men. And, as per the new guidence, which one someone can use is solely to be determined by what gender they were assigned at birth
Yes, it’s incredibly stupid, but that’s what the law currently says
If only laws could be changed
I know, right? This government has chosen to go “well, if the Supreme Court says we have to discriminate against trans people, then i guess we do “, rather than ” if the law can be interpreted in that way then it’s obviously wrong or unclear. We have a large majority and a progressive core of voters, let’s change the law “
It’s like come on guys, this is exactly the strength of the UK NOT having a written constitution - you can change the law and thereby change the constitution
So make the toilets as outlined above, but on the last two doors in the row mark one male and one female.
Yeah. The minority of loud stupid/paid people who care about this really are the ones who should be inconvenienced. If you want a gendered bathroom then there’s an outbuilding you can use. It’s on one plot so technically we’re still within code.
I’m far from an expert on this, but my understanding is that that could work, but it could also fall foul of other building regs, specifically the H&S regulations of 1992, which talk about toilets being suitable and sufficient
In my inexpert opinion it’d be enough of a grey area that you could challenge it in court if you were told it wasn’t allowed. In practical terms, no company is likely to do this unless they were specifically trying to take it to court to challenge the law or bring it more public agenda
But it’s s good idea and I’d support any company that tried it
That’s stupid
That’s anti-trans bigotry for you
This is not a bad consequence, better for all of us, even if the trigger is fear and spite
As a parent of two, this is best for the kids they claim to worry about. It makes potty training much less stressful
Why the fuck do these perverts care so much about what people do in a bathroom? How fucking weird
A female colleague proclaims often loudly how disgusting she finds it to see a male colleague leave the unisex toilet at the office. I’ve asked her if those men are leaving a mess or what specifically was disgusting, and she says she just finds it gross that a man uses the same toilet.
I feel that the segregation is too engrained into our generation to move away from separated toilets. Honestly it’s a miracle we no longer have segregated toilets by skin color in the South.
I was confused, but then the article was about the UK, where they stupidly did Brexit. Don’t worry, everybody. This is just about people who make dumb decisions.
You say that, but I mean have you looked around here lately? The Bri’ish don’t have a monopoly on stupid.
single sex toilets must be forever prohibited from existing, says actual equality and human rights
Why?
There are many different forms of sex people can have in public toilets and so restricting them to just one kind wouldn’t be equal.
Yeah! Justice for straight people! No longer shall we be forced to excuse ourselves in restaurants only to shamefully walk into the opposite gender bathroom to have sneaky restaurant sex with our partners! We want a bathroom where both men and women can walk in with their heads held high and then do unmentionable things to each other while their friends are waiting for desert to arrive!
Lmaooo… Best reply to my comment fr
Just have a bunch of single stalls and sinks. Why do we need gendered bathrooms?
I’m there to take a shit. I don’t care if a woman is washing her hands.
Not necessarily in the defense of single sex toilets, but I imagine not all men are gentle, and women (maybe even anyone else) would choose not to get peeked at from above by a nasty weirdo. I know, I know, not like only one gender could do it, but if I had to find a reason why one would want to have single sex toilets, this would be the reason that makes the most sense to me.
Or, you know, people being religious fanatics stuck in the 18th century, but who would be like that in 2026? /s
That’s just a consequence of shitty bathroom design. In civilized places, bathroom stalls have actual walls and doors that go to the floor and ceiling.
That’s totally true. I just thought of the possibility because I grew up where not every toilet was civilised.
Eeeh, first one may not be that removed from actual risk. If we assume 1/10 of population is perverted, then cutting out hetero folks from perving on opposite sex is cutting that 1/10 to 1/100. So the chance some perv will actually go for it is lower. And this is a bigger issue for women than men, so makes sense to be watching out for that.
In USA that is, in EU we have full size stall doors and walls :|
People don’t just wash hands in a bathroom sink. They wash their face, groom themselves, admire themselves, apply makeup, etc.
Also, why waste space with stalls, when you can use urinals instead? I don’t want to wait outside a stall to take a piss.
The first thing you named everyone does so it doesnt need to be private.
The second thing is a urinal takes up a stall space so just have more stalls.
After being to places that do this, I can tell you it works fine.
I don’t want to mog myself in the mirror in front of women.
Also, urinals absolutely don’t take up as much space as stalls.
Ok, then don’t do that.
Nah… mogging myself in the mirror is the peak of my day
You can’t check how you look in the mirror in front of other people? Why, what difference would it make what gender they are, that’s kind of weird.
Nobody is watching you, you can grow up and deal with it.
Yes the space savings is based on only requiring one room vs two. And even in a one room scenerio the loss isn’t that much, about 1 urinal space for ever 14 stalls. Not to mention that there never is one room empty the other waiting scenerio.
Again, I was just in a facility that does this. These rooms are easy, convenient, and safe because the sink areaks open to the hall. It works great.
Stalls are not as efficient space, material, or queue wise compared to urinals. For those with penises and the need to pee, urinals are just better. It would be stupid to remove these.
Not really no. Because you are now requiring two seperate bathrooms. Urinals dont really save any space, you cannot share it. So one row of lets say 12 stalls floor to ceiling are just as efficient. Only one common area open to the hall way, only one plumbing row (same a a urinal) and only one bathroom.
This system is more effective and just works.
Also, you add as many areas like this as the building requires.
Do you have a urinal at home?
Urinals can be packed far more tightly than stalls, so no they are not just as efficient. Urinals are also optimal for high traffic/volume scenarios, so having one at home is not necessary. They’re also easier to clean and maintain.
Limited gender washrooms < “Shitter”
Like come on this is not that hard, everybody poops.
