After almost 25 years now, there are more things we still can learn about that day. Silverstein had signed a 99-year lease for the World Trade Center complex just weeks before the attacks. Silverstein has stated that he typically attended meetings at the World Trade Center every morning. However, on 9/11, he did not go to the office due to a medical appointment. This detail has frequently resurfaced in documentaries, news reports, and online discussions as people revisit the events of that tragic day.
Yeah, most people don’t realize the wtc was a really shitty building that no one really wanted to lease from. Part of the reason the collapses were so bad was because the city management had moved as many publicly run organizations headquarters there as a way to subsidize the building. One of the reasons the port authority was awal for much of the event was because the port authority headquarters was located in one of the towers.
I haven’t looked into the information that video uses for their sources about finace, but just judging by what they had to say about the engineering aspects about wtc7 collapse, I would be dubious.
The study they are talking about from the university of Alaska fairbanks is very flawed and was paid for by the Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth.
Their conclusion was that the collapse couldn’t be accounted for by fire alone, but that ignores the fact that the structural fire was caused by large debris that penetrated multiple floors and caused a huge amount of damage to the structural supports of the building.
The study has also been proven incorrect about their assumption about fire being unable to suddenly collapse a steel framed building of that size. Since 9/11 there have 2 or three steel framed sky scrapers that have suddenly collapsed due to uncontrolled fires.
If the video’s misrepresentation about engineering is reflected in the financial portion of the video… I wouldn’t be confident that anything they said was an accurate reflection of reality.
Exactly HOW building 7 fell isn’t really relevant when it’s well-documented that the building was fully evacuated and destroyed, despite being nowhere near ground zero. It’s also very suspicious as to how the fire even started in the first place.
It might be impossible to know the exact details of how every little thing went down. But, just because you can’t determine all that doesn’t mean the narrative we’ve all been given is completely correct.
The idea that Bin Laden operated alone, independently of US influence, and without anyone in the US knowing what he was planning, stinks to high hell.
I think that’s called moving the goal post.
It’s pretty normal to evacuate a building when it’s been hit by debris and has been set on fire… Also wtc7 was only 350 feet north of a near 1400 foot tower, it’s extremely easy to see why that’s still in the danger zone. You don’t even have to use your imagination, you can look up pictures of the damage caused by the debris.
A large chunk of debris falling through several floors of an office building does not seem like a very suspicious reason for a fire.
First of all, I didn’t make any claims about the narrative. I was just commenting on misleading engineering claims. Secondly, just because you can’t determine the exact details of how every little thing went down does not necessarily mean that the narrative is inherently false.
Who is making these claims? Its well known that 9/11 was political blowback from the deterioration of the US and Bin Ladens relationship the Middle East. It’s also pretty well known that several US intelligence agencies were alerted of potential terrorist attacks via airlines, and that they were being uncooperative and incompetent.
If we are evaluating competing scenario of what really happened that day we can use some reason and logic. One story requires a massive conspiracy conducted by multiple intelligence agencies, wealthy private citizens, demolition crews, and politicians… potentially hundreds to thousands of people who have all been extremely competent and have kept their mouths shut for several decades.
The other scenario requires decades of the US government doing stupid shit in the middle East, and a couple intelligence agencies with an established history of fucking around and finding out to be incompetent.
Now I’m not saying there weren’t clandestine actors who didn’t ignore credible information about a potential attack, or there isn’t funny business between the US government and a country like Saudi Arabia. But that tends to be how things go, politicians never let a good tragedy go to waste.
(I’m a different guy and I’m not arguing you on anyting else BUT:)
Totally possible. There’ve been things of that magnitude that were hidden for decades that finally did get whistle blown, it’s entirely possible (I mean it’s almost impossible that there wouldn’t be) other things that never did get whistle blown (at least yet.)
Just look at some of the large scale operations we have come to learn about (be they leaked or later declassified), MK Ultra, MK Naomi, Operation Paperclip, Project PRISM, now they’re doing UFO disclosure so apparently that’s been real in some capacity and been covered up since like 1947, that recent Mossad deal with the pagers, pretty sure Epstein was a Mossad honeypot (but that one “isn’t proven yet.”)
“Well we know about those now” yeah and we didn’t for years before we did, it’s more likely than not that “now” is the “before we knew” years for something large and conspiratorially organized (not necessarily 9/11). To say otherwise is to assume we know everything the various agencies (CIA, FBI, Mossad) are doing, which is patently ridiculous to assume.
Furthermore I think it’d take less people “in the know” than you may think. Those agencies (namely CIA) work because of compartmentalization, the agent knows his part and any info needed to make that happen, and that’s it. The next agent in the chain knows his part and nothing more, and so on. In the end there may be only a couple people who actually know the entire picture. Also “we’ll fucking kill you and frame you for CP and destroy your entire family” will do wonders for a motherfucker’s will to speak up, and I don’t think a little murder here or there “in the interest of national security” has ever stopped the CIA before. I don’t think they’re stopping at “but you signed an NDA” for something as big as like Operation Northwoods.
Those examples are a bit different in scale. Mk ultra only involved a couple hundred researches/agents. It also didn’t kill thousands of people and was first brought to public light in 1974, just a couple years after the program ended.
Project Mk Naomi involved significantly less people and was made aware to the public in 1975, 5 years after it was shut down.
Operation paperclip didn’t kill people and started leaking to the public within a year.
The Prism program didn’t kill people, began in 2008 and was famously leaked by Snowden in 2013.
As far as Ufo disclosure, I’m not really sure if that really fits into the scheme of large conspiracy. The leaks have mainly been utilized as a political tool to divert eyes from the administration, and have largely been uneventful.
The mossad pager bombs did kill dozens of people and injured thousands and we found out about who did it and how almost immediately. So I’m not sure if that aid your overarching argument.
The information surrounding all these examples were all illuminated within a couple years of the events. They may have not resonated with the general public, but they also were much smaller in scale and less destructive to the general public than 9/11.
I don’t think we know everything about the alphabet orgs in the government, but they really aren’t very good about keeping large and impactful programs from the public. In general the larger a secret is the harder it is to keep people quiet. I mean hypothetically, how much money would it take to insure you didn’t go to the public about your involvement with something as horrible as 9/11? What’s the likelihood that a bunch of blue collar workers are going to agree to demolish a building with people inside it?
That’s not how something like a planned demolition works… A large building usually has about 150 people working together in constant communication. It takes engineers, construction workers, explosive experts, and enough hands to lay down miles of cable. That’s just for something the size of a hotel, the towers or even wt7 would take hundreds of people working for weeks, and that’s just the deomol5 aspect. You would also have hundreds of agents working to coordinate planes, schedules, and running interference inside the buildings. It’s just not feasible.
Plus, I think even the most slow witted agent would put the pieces together after the event occured.
There’s a reason they operate in compartmentalized cells, and it’s because secrets are famously hard to keep, even with the threat of violence. Something like 9/11 is just too large to operate successfully in the compartmentalization necessary to keep it hidden.
There’s a reason Northwood never happened, it would have impossible to keep secret
These agencies are made of people, people run their mouths. The simple fact is there hasn’t been a single credible person to come forward in the last 25 years that has stated they were part of a conspiracy surrounding 9/11. That level of secrecy is just not feasible, and is a lot less possible than the actual explanation.
Speaking of Snowden and 9/11, I’m a fan of his take on the “conspiracy.”
Not that it was an inside job and the alphabet agencies purposely took down those buildings. The way I remember Snowden describing it was that CIA, FBI, NSA, and others knew about the attack ahead of time, but each of those departments wanted to be THE ONE TO STOP IT. So instead of working together, which if they had done they might’ve actually been able to thwart it, they would instead compete against eachother with more government funding being the prize. The conspiracy isn’t some financial cover up, or a false flag event, or a reptilian sacrifice to their death god or whatever. The conspiracy is that these agencies are more concerned about competing against one another for funding instead of working together to prevent attacks and loss of life. Just classic capitalism shit.
Then speaking of classic capitalism shit, because the attacks were known about ahead of time, insider trading happened and that would explain the shorting of United Airline stocks in the week before it happened. A lot of people saw opportunity from that tragedy, that could’ve been avoided, but wasn’t due to greed, competitiveness, and hubris.
That is my general thought on the matter, never attribute to malice to an event which can be explained by incompetency. That was one of the main reasons for the justification for the creation of the DHS, the agencies basically needed a babysitter to force them to communicate instead of beef over funding and jurisdiction.
The idea is just more grounded in reality and actually has evidence to support it. I don’t know why people feel the need to attribute super competency to organizations that have so many losses on their record. Just to attribute extra malice to an organization that doesn’t need the help.
The only thing they’re half-competent at is hiring local police to help kill civil rights leaders. Other than that these agencies fucking suck at their jobs and are really expensive about it too.
Yeap, and that typically doesn’t take very much arm twisting, nor do they really seem to really care if it’s done on the hush hush.
You (should) get my point though, regardless of if deaths or coconspirators match up 1:1, things do happen that are orchestrated by multiple people that you and I do not know about, to believe otherwise is arrogant.
The amount deaths are irrelevant (and btw about 14 boxes of paperwork were destroyed, we’ll never know what that contained…), point is that from 50-70 when the “program shut down” (…riiiiight) 20 yr, it was still a secret program and “not happening.” 4 years later turns out the “crazies” like me suggesting a government experimental conspiracy to test acid and other mind control methods on some of our nation’s most prominent assassins and murderers and creating the hippy movement by accident were right the whole time…
It fits, they’ve said “nuh uh” for almost 80 years and lord knows how many people have been involved in the cover up, “uh huh” still means “uh huh” even if they’re only admitting it now because of Epstein (which again let me remind you is yet ANOTHER conspiracy involving conspirators that has come to light after 20yr of operation…) if I murder someone and only admit it because it distracts from my crimes coming to light, I still murdered the guy even if the admission is “a distraction” from whatever was coming to light.
And how long were they working on it before we found out? The fact you seem to think you know everything in real time baffles me, you really can’t admit that maybe large organized intelligence rings may do things you don’t know about?
That you know of.
A few hundered thousand bucks and the assurance that you’ll kill my family if I speak up even though I won’t be believed because I don’t have concrete proof oughta cover it.
Did you properly threaten their families? Makes it more likely…
Again I’m not saying that this is the case for 9/11 specifically, I’m saying “the government could never keep a secret” is patently ridiculous to assume.
Easier when
Kennedy said “Er Uh, no.”
Is that what it would take to make you finally realize you don’t know everything about everything? Well again I wasn’t even saying 9/11 was a conspiracy but now I hope that happens just so you personally can realize the world isn’t as simple as you seem to believe.
And you should understand that context and scale is important. I never claimed that all conspiracy is impossible to keep secret for some time, just that the scale of the conspiracy and what the conspiracy is doing has a direct correlation on how easy it is to keep secret. Mkultra was easier to keep under wraps because people were personally benefitting from the distribution of drugs, and those taking the drugs for the most part were happy to do so.
Deaths create the motive to investigate, to say they don’t matter is just silly. It wasn’t the “crazies” who uncovered mkultra, that was done by professional reporters.
None of the stuff they said “nuh uh” too has been confirmed by any of the disclosure. All they’ve done is release files of sightings of suspicious objects they’ve catalogued. It’s not like they’ve come out and said Roswell was real and we’ve been using alien tech this whole time. There hasn’t been a single disclosure that’s confirmed we’re dealing with anything extraterrestrial.
As far as Epstein goes, there were public reports about his illicit activities going back as far as the early 00’s. His operation is more of an indictment on how little the general public care about young women than it is some secretive government program.
Literally the same year… Hezbollah switched from walkie talkies to pagers in 2024 and Israel found an opportunity to intercept them before they arrived.
And again… I never claimed things were impossible to plan in secret or that the public knows exactly what’s going on at all times. Just that after the event occured and bodies start pulling up people will start investigating what happened. At that point operations involving a lot of people are easy to investigate. I don’t know where you’re getting the notion I claimed we are omnipresent and omniscient.
As the evidence leads us to believe. All the examples you’ve given thus far I have rebuttals for. I can’t disprove something something that you can’t prove happened. All I can do is give context and examples that rebute your argument.
Any examples of this being offered to anyone? Any examples of mysterious deaths of entire families connected to a conspiracy? Do you make the offer before you get involved? Do you kill the people who refuse to involve themselves before you tell them what they are doing? You don’t think that would lead a paper trail?
No death bed confessions? No evidence of a thousand demolition experts converging on NYC before 9/11? No testimony of blue collar workers being approached for a secret job in NYC before 9/11? This is not a television show, and the cia or FBI aren’t nearly as competent as what you are thinking. They aren’t all mindless killing machines willing to take out innocent American workers without question for a job. How many sociopaths do you think work for the cia?
Yes, and I never claimed that. That’s just a straw man argument you seem to be fixated on fighting despite the fact that all my rebuttals have been framed on how your examples differ from 9/11. My claim was that the level of secrecy required to pull of a conspiracy the scale of 9/11 would be impossible.
Yes, and a high number of compartmentalized cells become inefficient at scale. It’s like playing phone tag, the more cells you have working the harder it is to communicate and allocate resources. The biggest trade off with covert large cell orginazations is that the larger the network is the less it can organize in a coherent manner.
And you don’t think the idea of political blowback had anything to do with that?
Ahh yes, the absence of evidence is actually evidence itself! Again if the government was willing and capable to commit to the actions you have described to keep secrets, then why do we know anything about all the examples of uncovered conspiracies you already listed?
Did threatening families not exist before the 2000’s? Why aren’t all of snowdens family members mysteriously gone?
Lol, you hope it’s true that the government murdered thousands of US citizens just so you “win” an argument? You seem like a reasonable and well adjusted human being…
I hope that you recover from your inforwars based brain injury.